Wednesday, October 19, 2011

[sehat] Digest Number 16296

Milis SEHAT Group

Messages In This Digest (25 Messages)

1a.
Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya? From: aries3_dee84@yahoo.com
1b.
Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya? From: Elga Soeardi
1c.
Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya? From: kiky aulia
2a.
(Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2 From: Rini Adhitya
2b.
Re: (Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2 From: siti amatullah mutmainah
2c.
Re: (Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2 From: purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id
3a.
Re: [help] Minta Link bahaya waterbirth.. From: goofypinkku83@yahoo.com
3b.
Re: [help] Minta Link bahaya waterbirth.. From: ChiciErnest
4.
Suspect nyeri di Lambung - Mungkinkah efek obat2an? From: venyyosephine@gmail.com
5a.
Re: Mohon dibantu --> bingung soal batuk From: Sisilia
6a.
MMR dan Hep A From: imel1405@gmail.com
6b.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: Sisilia
6c.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: tristanathan.amadeo@gmail.com
6d.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id
6e.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: imel1405@gmail.com
6f.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: imel1405@gmail.com
6g.
Re: MMR dan Hep A From: Sisilia
7.
(no subject) From: anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com
8a.
Re: re : FW: [Hukum-Online] Penyebab Harga Obat Mahal - Dokter Raup From: drjohanwidj
9a.
Mohon bantuan tt berat badan anak saya. Normalkah? From: anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com
9b.
Mohon bantuan tt berat badan anak saya. Normalkah? From: anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com
10.
imunisasi kurang From: goofypinkku83@yahoo.com
11.
Imunisasi yang kurang From: goofypinkku83@yahoo.com
12.1.
Re: Need_Info: Tes Bakat Anak lewat Sidik Jari di Bekasi/Jakarta From: aina
13.
[SHARE] ini perjalanan RUMku, apa perjalanan RUMmu... (1) From: Denella Hadibroto

Messages

1a.

Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya?

Posted by: "aries3_dee84@yahoo.com" aries3_dee84@yahoo.com   aries3_dee84

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:00 am (PDT)



Mba Q sebelum kedokter coba mampir dulu ke mayoclinic untuk cek berdasarkan gejalanya?

Coba dicocokin:

www.mayoclinic.com search symtom checker

Ini Linknya:

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/symptom-checker/DS00671


Rgds
Dian-bunda Akhtar
*semoga ga ada yg serius?
Sent from my AXIS Worry Free BlackBerry® smartphone
1b.

Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya?

Posted by: "Elga Soeardi" elgasoeardi@yahoo.com   elgasoeardi

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:03 am (PDT)



Ky, observasi dulu aja 2-3 hari..kalo mau flu berat kan emg gitu biasanya..
Buat nyamanin selain minum yg byk, rendeman air anget klo gak bs seluruh badan ya kaki aja biar rileks
Kmren gw gitu kok, kepala berat ky mau pecah, badan linu2 aplg kalo dipegang orang, demam pulak eh trnyata bbrp hari kemudian keluarlah s pilek..
Istirahat total ajah klo gw sih

Mudah2an gak ada yg serius ya ky, klo pun mau ngecek coba pake symtom checker di mayoclinic biar gak tebak2 buah manggis

Salam
Elga
@ elgasoeardi Sent from BlackBerry®
1c.

Re: Kira2 sakit apa ya?

Posted by: "kiky aulia" kylia.an@yahoo.com   kylia.an

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:18 am (PDT)



dian n elga...

Thank you yaa. Aku jln2 ke mayoclinic dl deh. Mdh2an bnr cm mau pilek ato cm krn cape :)


Kiky
Sent from my BlackBerry®
powered by Sinyal Kuat INDOSAT

-----Original Message-----
From: "Elga Soeardi" <elgasoeardi@yahoo.com>
Sender: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 11:03:33
To: Milis sehat<sehat@yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sehat] Kira2 sakit apa ya?

Ky, observasi dulu aja 2-3 hari..kalo mau flu berat kan emg gitu biasanya..
Buat nyamanin selain minum yg byk, rendeman air anget klo gak bs seluruh badan ya kaki aja biar rileks
Kmren gw gitu kok, kepala berat ky mau pecah, badan linu2 aplg kalo dipegang orang, demam pulak eh trnyata bbrp hari kemudian keluarlah s pilek..
Istirahat total ajah klo gw sih

Mudah2an gak ada yg serius ya ky, klo pun mau ngecek coba pake symtom checker di mayoclinic biar gak tebak2 buah manggis

Salam
Elga
@ elgasoeardi Sent from BlackBerry®

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2a.

(Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2

Posted by: "Rini Adhitya" verini_zen@yahoo.com   verini_zen

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:02 am (PDT)



Dear All,

Pernah adakah yang memiliki pengalaman seperti berikut;

Pagi ini putri pertama kami, Fazza, 4th mengalami kejadian yang mengerikan-bagi kami. Tanpa indikasi yang jelas dan tiba2. Saat itu waktunya mandi pagi. Fazza hendak membuka celana tidurnya dan mendadak dia mengeluh "mama mual, mau muntah.." Sambil tersedu, Kami belum sempat melihatnya, papanya sedang bersiap ke kantor,dari ekor mata saya dia terlihat terduduk, dan tiba2 "dug.." Fazza terkulai di lantai. Saya dan suami spontan menoleh dan putri kami itu sesak nafas, mukanya pucat, sedetik itu pula saya angkat ke pangkuan sambil memanggil namanya, begitu jg suami, belum sempat lagi berpikir tiba2 tubuhnya kaku dan berhenti bernafas!

Suami saya spontan menggendongnya keluar sambil menepuk2 punggungnya dan memanggil namanya, saya mengikuti dibelakangnya sambil memanggil namanya juga. Kami panik.
Beberapa detik (+/-10detik) berselang dalam kepanikan, Fazza akhirnya mulai bernafas lagi.Setelah minum air hangat,keluar keringat dingin+mukanya pucat.Ga lama abis mnm,muntah.Sy kasih minum+2suap nasi,muntah lg.Sy kasih minum+1/2slice roti,muntah lg.Sy kasih susu 100ml.Udah mulai ceria lg.Sy lsg bw k dokter.Disarankan CTscan,sdh 1jam d ruangan CTscan anaknya ga mau tiduran.Kata dokter,jgn dipaksa klo anaknya ga mau (takut anaknya stress).Kita pulang dengan oleh2 observasi 24jam+obat2an : oralit(menghindari dehidrasi)+becombion(vitamin)+ranivel(obat mual)+stesolid(jika kejang).Sy blm sempat browsing mengenai obat2nya.

Mohon pencerahannya dari SP's & Doc's. Apa sebaiknya fazza d CTscan (masuk ruangannya aja dia udah stress) atau cari 2nd opinion ? Klo mau browsing keywordnya apa ya ? Utk bekal klo mau 2nd opinion.

Big Thx,
Rini
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2b.

Re: (Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2

Posted by: "siti amatullah mutmainah" amianakbinus@yahoo.com   amianakbinus

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:10 am (PDT)



Mba,
Hugs dulu ah.. Panik pasti yah.. I feel u .. (Ikutan mba di )
Saran sy fokus dulu dehidrasinya..
Vitamin hmmm biasanya memicu mual justru ..

Stesolid obat utk kejang, pingsan beda sm kejang ..

IMO mba, observasi, fokus ke dehidrasi, tetap waspada kegwtdaruratan anak ..

Denyut nadinya gmn mba? Lemah atau kuat?

Maaf ga bantu byk

Smoga lekas sembuh

Rgds,
Ami




Sent from AmiBerry® via Smart 1x / EVDO Network.
2c.

Re: (Ask)Mual+Pingsan tiba2+Muntah2

Posted by: "purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id" purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:57 am (PDT)



Coba ke dsa ahli neurologi
Mungkin perlu eeg
Mungkin itu bangkitan kejang (tapi bisa saja saya salah)

Wati
Patient Safety, first

3a.

Re: [help] Minta Link bahaya waterbirth..

Posted by: "goofypinkku83@yahoo.com" goofypinkku83@yahoo.com   goofypinkku83

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:08 am (PDT)



Dear SP's, Bunda Wati dan Bunda Neisha,

Dibawah ini adalah petikan Email dari Bunda Wati :
"Secara ilmiah: (please kalau mau cari info jangan di webnya water birth
karena pasti akan menonjolkan sisi positifnya ... sama juga dengan
hypnobirthing ... jadi carinya di asosiasi obstetri dan ginekologi)"

Yang mau saya tanyakan, apa yg bunda wati maksudkan dengan kata-kata sama juga dengan hypnobirthing?? Apakah dari sugesti nya atau apa nya? Karena saya berencana ikut kelas hypnobirthing minggu depan. Kemudian Kcarinya di asosiasi obstetri dan ginekologi.. Web nya apa ya?.


Terima Kasih.

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-----Original Message-----
From: Monik Bunda Neisha <email.mymilis@gmail.com>
Sender: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 15:50:32
To: <sehat@yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sehat] [help] Minta Link bahaya waterbirth..

Saya repost email Bunda Wati ya..

salam,

Monik

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Purnamawati <>
Date: Wed, Jan 6, 2010 at 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: [sehat] Re: Tolong sharing hypnobirthing
To: sehat@yahoogroups.com

Dear Dewi
thanks sharingnya

boleh ikutan nimbrung ya
please jangan upset ya

Saya concern sekali dengan waterbirth
Mengapa?
Secara ilmiah: (please kalau mau cari info jangan di webnya water birth
karena pasti akan menonjolkan sisi positifnya ... sama juga dengan
hypnobirthing ... jadi carinya di asosiasi obstetri dan ginekologi)
1. Tidak pernah terbukti bahwa water birth berhasil menghilangkan rasa
sakit. Lebih ke arah sugesti
2. Water birth terkait risiko morbiditas dan mortalitas buat bayi
3. Water birth di negara maju dilarang dikerjakan di kehidupan sehari2
Hanya boleh dikerjakan di institusi pendidikan kedokteran dalam setting:
penelitian
Dengan catatan ... ibu diberi tahu secara jujur apa saja risikonya

berikut kutipan singkat dari beberapa penelitian:
http://www.pediatrics.org/cgi/content/full/110/2/409:

Water Birth—A Near-Drowning Experience

Can delivery in water cause serious adverse outcomes? Undoubtedly, the
answer is "yes." There are several reports of death attributable to drowning
resulting from poorly managed water births1 and 1 death, involving 2
experienced midwives, in which asphyxiation and water-logged lungs made
resuscitation of the infant difficult.2 The latter case led to the cessation
of water births in Sweden. In their report of 4 infants with water
aspiration that appears in this issue of Pediatrics, Nguyen et al3 provide
additional evidence that water birth does cause adverse outcomes. Their
argument for causality rests on the demonstration of radiograph appearances
of gross pulmonary edema and, in 1 infant, hyponatraemia.

A surveillance study in England and Wales found a perinatal morality rate of
1.2/1000 (5/4030; 95% confidence interval [CI]: 0.4, 2.9) for infants
delivered via water birth.5 Compared with low-risk deliveries that are
nonwater births, the upper 99% confidence limit for the relative risk of
perinatal death after delivery in water was 3.6/1000 ([relative risk (RR):
0.9: 99% CI: 0.2, 3.6 1.2] 1.2). The risk of admission to the neonatal
intensive care unit for lower respiratory tract problems (2 explicitly
attributed to water aspiration) was 0.4% (95% CI: 0.2, 0.6%) or 1 in 270.

Other adverse outcomes included a surprising number of infants (n 5) with a
snapped umbilical cord, of whom 1 required a transfusion. This finding may
be attributable to rapid cord traction as the infant is brought to the
surface and could be remedied by lowering the water level as the infant is
born.

Nah berikutnya:

http://www.pediatrics.org/cgi/content/full/115/5/1413:

Underwater Births (silakan baca sendiri ya... saya kasih penutupnya saja:

The safety and efficacy of underwater birth for the newborn has not been
established. There is no convincing evidence of benefit to the neonate but
some concern for serious harm. Therefore, underwater birth should be
considered an experimental procedure that should not be performed except
within the context of an appropriately designed RCT after informed parental
consent.

DOI: 10.1542/peds.2004-0145

Pediatrics 2004;114;855-858

Ken Schroeter

Water Births: A Naked Emperor

http://www.pediatrics.org/cgi/content/full/114/3/855

Water Births: A Naked Emperor

ABBREVIATIONS. RCT, randomized, controlled trial; CI, 95% confidence
interval.

In Hans Christian Andersen's sartorial tale of a vain emperor,1 it takes a
child's vision to bring clarity to an awkward situation. Despite knowing the
naked truth, the people scold the child for speaking out and actively ignore
the issues raised by his challenge. In a sense, water births, the birthing
of an infant underwater, are much like the emperor's new clothes in that
some people believe what they wish to serve their own purpose while actively
ignoring the facts at hand and admonishing those who question their
opinions. Despite an absence of supporting evidence, proponents of water
births claim benefits and disregard concerns while continuing to fail to
subject this approach to the rigors of scientific inquiry.

This desire to ignore the facts may be particularly prevalent among
individuals who prefer nontraditional delivery techniques. In a 1989
editorial in the Journal of Nurse-Midwifery, Elder2 compelled readers to put
aside concerns about a lack of research and data, essentially to feel little
need for this information when considering alternative practices, but
instead to seek a "balanced perspective" against such "rigorous analysis."
Elder wrote: "If one claims something is a fact, how should the claim be
supported? Indeed, must it be supported?" She offered that nurse midwives,
among the majority of proponents of alternative childbirth methods, should
be "pioneers," taking pride in offering unproven alternatives. By advocating
for this approach, she validated the long-recognized gap that separates
practitioners of evidence-based medicine from practitioners

who accept unproven alternatives as a basis for practice.

In the current era of natural and alternative medicine, practices such as
water births continue to be introduced without validation of their equality
or superiority to standard obstetrical practice and despite some clear
potential risks. In such a model, good alternative birthing practices cannot
be differentiated from the bad. The resulting friction creates an "us versus
them" childbirth environment that cannot serve the best interests of
patients. In a cautionary commentary, McGraw3 noted that consumer demand for
painless deliveries was originally responsible for the medicalization of
childbirth. This process took labor and delivery from midwives in the home
and brought it to the hospital under the guidance of physicians. He observed
that nurse midwives returned to the practice of childbirth only as segments
of popular sentiment decried this medicalization. Many nurse midwives (and
some physicians) offer alternative practices, the proponents of which "have
all too often made broad, sweeping, and unsupported claims." In the case of
water births, claims are made for significantly decreasing the need for
medical-surgical intervention, medications, episiotomy, and cesarean
sections as well as offering a more natural and less traumatic birth
experience for the infant. Water births are also offered to families who
seek relief from the perceived loss of control during "medical"
childbirth.4–7 Daniels, an-oft cited nonclinician proponent of water births,
noted that, "in the U.S., institutionalized medicine has virtually taken
over childbirth. It has created a plethora of procedures for the convenience
and benefit of doctors and hospital staff, rather than for the safety and
comfort of the mother and baby."7 This belief continues as a consistent
theme underwriting alternative childbirth practices. Gilbert,8 in her
commentary on an article by Nyguen et al,9 notes that "advocates of water
birth cite empowerment and autonomy over birth as one of the main advantages
but fail to give information about the potential harms of water birth."

The co-author of a surveillance- and-survey study in the British Isles on
water births (described below),10 Gilbert agrees with the risk of serious
adverse outcomes. She reminds us that women are most readily empowered when
they are provided with the information that enables them to make the best
possible decisions. The paucity of sound medical literature about water
births suggests that proponents would rather not truly empower women with
validated information but instead relegate the birth process to a more
mystical experience. Not only is such an approach unsafe, but it demeans
women who need clear information to make the best possible decisions for
themselves and their child's future.

Is there efficacy and safety in water birth at least equal to conventional
birth? Is there objective information to support each claim? Does outcome
vary by setting (ie, home water birth or hospital-based water birth)? Is
water labor without water birth efficacious and safe? Is the safety of
immersion the same as conventional births but with different problems? Women
deciding on childbirth options and the clinicians who advise them cannot
give sound informed consent without this information.

Primum non nocere (first, do no harm) is one of the basic tenets of modern
medical practice. It arose from the understanding that the physician is
compelled to demonstrate that the benefit of any medical approach outweighs
the risk and that the practice is in fact beneficial to the patient. Careful
scientific investigation and analysis are now the traditional means by which
the physician learns where a particular practice lies on the risk-benefit
spectrum. This approach is the fundamental concept of evidence-based
medicine. If a procedure or medication has merit, that value can be readily
demonstrated in a thoughtfully designed scientific study or review. In
understanding the responsibility to determine benefit while reducing risk,
physicians are continuously reassessing their practice standards. Any new
approach to care is subjected to critical peer-reviewed evaluation in
medical journals, conferences, and at the patient's bedside. Meritorious
medications and techniques will stand up to scientific testing, randomized,
controlled trials (RCTs) when applicable, whereas suboptimal approaches will
be abandoned. In the absence of such evidence-based investigation, there can
be no advances in medical practice, simply one person's opinions against
another's. The resulting chaos would be a reversion to the early history of
medicine, and the increased morbidity and mortality would be welcomed only
by malpractice attorneys. RCTs derive their validity in part from the
ethical hypothesis that one method is at least as safe and efficacious as
another and that a patient randomized into one group or the other is not at
increased risk of a poor outcome. The goal is to prove that, in fact, one
method is more efficacious than another. Proponents of water birth should
feel compelled to either undertake the challenge of designing and
implementing a sound RCT or admit that such a randomization is unethical
because the risk is actually greater in water births. As scientific
practitioners, we must remain skeptical of untested regimens and beliefs at
all times no matter what the anecdotal evidence suggests or how compelling
the untested story is.11,12 In this manner, we repeatedly challenge our
medical practices to be certain that the emperor does indeed have clothes
and, most importantly, to better serve our patients.

Unfortunately water births have received little such scrutiny. A current
review of Medline-referenced articles reveals no substantial controlled
research and certainly no well-designed RCTs of water birth. There have been
a few studies, including RCTs, assessing water labor, but most of them are
not well designed and offer contrary findings, providing little insight on
the effects of water immersion on the infant.13,14 Many studies mix water
labor and water birth, confounding evaluation of these distinct practices.

Nikodem14 found only 3 acceptable trials in his Cochrane review, first
completed in 1997 and updated in 1999 (the primary focus of these trials was
immersion in labor, not necessarily birth underwater). All suffer from
significant methodologic flaws, primarily performance bias. Rush et al15
conducted the largest study of some 800 women (the other 2 studies together
add _200 patients), 46% of the women in the immersion group did not use the
tub but were still included in the intention-to-treat arm. Additionally, the
authors included 41 noneligible women in the data analysis. Nikoderm's
review determined that there were no statistically significant differences
between immersion and nonimmersion in regards to pain relief, augmentation
and duration of the first stage of labor, meconium-stained amniotic fluid,
perineal trauma, or neonatal outcomes (Apgar score, umbilical arterial pH,
and neonatal infection).

He concluded that there was insufficient evidence from available RCTs to
evaluate the use of the practice. Many physicians view the practice as
unproved and associated with significant, avoidable risks. In 1993,
Zimmerman et al,16 categorically challenged the claims of efficacy and
safety of water births. Reviewing the literature for proposed benefits, they
measured the safety and efficacy claims of proponents against physiologic
and general considerations.

Their review noted that experience and reason, let alone scientific
evaluation, did not support the claims of water-birth proponents. Other
authors have documented adverse neonatal outcomes including unexplained
deaths, drowning and neardrowning, asphyxiation, water intoxication
hyponatremia causing seizures, water aspiration leading to respiratory
distress syndrome and respiratory failure, pulmonary edema, snapped
umbilical cords, hypoxic-ischemic encephalopathy, pneumonia, and other
infections including Pseudomonas bacteremia.8–10,17,18

Gilbert and Tookey10 provide us with an "outsider's" objective perspective
on water births (they are epidemiologists). They provide us with the only
broad epidemiologic information available, although their study suffers from
the inherent flaws of a survey-based study. They undertook a difficult
surveillance- and-survey study of water births in England and Wales
occurring between April 1994 and April 1996 at 219 maternity units.
Specifically, they evaluated the voluntarily reported outcomes of water
birth and labor in water followed by out-of-water birth, comparing them with
documented outcomes in conventional deliveries (not clearly defined but not
in water). They received reports of 4032 such deliveries (0.6% of all
deliveries) from 213 centers in 1995 (97% response) and 184 centers in 1996
(86% response).

Among these births were 5 perinatal deaths and 34 special care admissions in
England and Wales after water birth that occurred within the first 48 hours
of life. Perinatal mortality associated with water labor and/or birth was
1.2 per 1000 live births (95% confidence interval [CI]: 0.4-2.9), with 8.4
per 1000 live births (95% CI: 5.8-11.8) requiring admission to a special
care nursery. In reports of low-risk, conventional deliveries in the United
Kingdom during the same period, mortality was 0.8-4.6 per 1000 live births
(95% CI: 0.2-4.2), with morbidity occurring in9.2-64 per 1000 (95% CI:
58-70) live births. No deaths were attributed directly to water birth. Two
infants were stillborn, 1 after a concealed pregnancy with no prenatal care
lead to an unattended home birth (the authors do not indicate why this birth
is included as a water birth). The 3 postpartum deaths were attributed to
pathologic processes. One died within 3 days due to neonatal herpes, another
expired at 30 minutes of life from intracranial hemorrhage after precipitous
delivery, and the other died at 8 hours of life, later determined to be due
to lung hypoplasia.

Thirty-four infants were admitted to special care within 48 hours of birth,
and 3 later died. Thirteen required respiratory support, and 15 survivors
were diagnosed with pneumonia, transient tachypnea or "wet lung," suspected
aspiration, meconium aspiration, water aspiration, and freshwater drowning
(1 who had hyponatremia).

Fifteen had other reasons for admission: 5 had snapped umbilical cords (1
requiring transfusion, 1 developing hypoxic ischemic encephalopathy grade 2,
and 1 with a chromosomal abnormality), 3 had stridor, 1 had shoulder
dystocia, 1 had hypoxic ischemic encephalopathy grade 3 and transposition of
the great arteries, another had a chromosomal abnormality, and 4 had no
clear reason or diagnosis.

Although conventional birth is associated with many of the types of negative
outcomes reported, it is evident that some are unique to water labor/birth.

Although concluding that the perinatal risk associated with water birth was
not substantially higher than that of infants born conventionally, Gilbert
and Tookey10 reported several significant methodologic limitations of their
study. Survey respondents over the 2-year course of the study declined
significantly between the 2 study years (13.6%), with as much as 18% of the
reports being based on estimates (presumably by responders) rather than
documented numbers. The risks were calculated from small numbers with wide
CIs. They were unable to clearly identify mothers who labored in but did not
deliver in water. Underreporting of admissions to special care after
delivery in water were suspected (although mortality numbers are felt to be
accurate), there was inconsistent recording of birth circumstances, and
specific risks and benefits were not being measured.

Gilbert and Tookey illuminated how difficult it is to assess the frequency
of delivery by water birth and associated outcomes worldwide. There is no
reporting requirement in the United States; many are home births, and many
are water labors that are not followed by water birth. In the United States,
there are increasing numbers of hospitals and home service agencies
providing tubs and information on water labor and birth, but there is no
central accrediting or regulating agency. The Joint Commission on
Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations does not evaluate centers or keep
specific information on the practice of water immersion or water birth (C.
Hill, Joint Commission on Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations, verbal
communication, 2004).

Individual case reports of infant morbidity and mortality with water births
appear increasingly in the medical literature, whereas the pleasant merits
of water births without adverse incidents continue to be published as case
reports and reviews in paramedical journals and Web sites.3,8–10,13,17–19
These latter anecdotal case reports ostensibly validate the safety and
efficacy of water births and are used as a basis for the claims of
proponents, but they provide no objective details of the circumstances of
those births, any long-term follow-up, or review of adverse outcomes across
a population. Improved recording of water labor and water births and
reliable, objective reporting of adverse events and outcomes could provide a
more reliable understanding of safety and efficacy. Such a compulsory
central registry could lead to a better foundation of knowledge from which
studies and protocol consensus could be derived.

In light of this, it is not surprising that how one conducts, or who can
conduct, a water birth has not been validly established. There is currently
no consensus for conducting water labor or water birth (ie, water-quality
assessments, temperature and maintenance, water depth or volume, fetal and
maternal assessments, etc), and much disparity in opinion and practice
exists.6 Because proponents of water immersion have not addressed questions
of safety and efficacy and have no central epidemiologic resource, they have
not developed a foundation or consensus for the practice. Hence, a
regulatory protocol or

agency does not exist (nor, in the context of antimedicalization, can it).
Given the incredible complexity of the childbirth process and the disparity
in case reports in the literature, a failure to develop a regulatory agency
or consensus protocol suggests that critical assessment of this technique
has not been appropriately forthcoming.

Water births currently provide no apparent benefit in childbirth. The
practice is based on misrepresentations of neonatal physiology and
unsupported claims of safety and efficacy. This birthing method fulfils no
need for the infant, is of dubious benefit to the mother, is associated with
significant, avoidable risks of morbidity and mortality, and currently is
unable to pass the risk-benefit test.

The continued push for water births in the absence of sound data to support
claims undermines the credibility of the obstetric profession as it
justifiably seeks to mitigate the necessary medicalization of childbirth.
Water births should not be considered an acceptable standard of care until
rigorous evaluation is pursued. Until that time, water births remain a naked
emperor, whose nakedness must be challenged despite a culture of active
ignoring that threatens to harm our patients and our profession.

Masih banyak lagio

Dari saya sendiri

secara common sense saja .... naturenya manusia .... melahirkan ya tidak di
air

maaf kalau tak berkenan

wati


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Milis SEHAT mengucapkan terimakasih kepada:
- Asuransi AIA atas partisipasinya sebagai sponsor PESAT Bali 2011
- PT LG Electronics Indonesia atas partisipasinya sebagai Sponsor Tunggal FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Terima kasih & penghargaan sedalam-dalamnya kepada : HBTLaw, PT.Intiland, dan PT. Permata Bank Tbk. yang telah dan konsisten mensponsori program kami, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."

"Milis SEHAT didukung oleh : CBN Net Internet Access &Website.
=================================================================
Milis Sehat thanks to:
- AIA Insurance as sponsor for PESAT Bali 2011
- PT LG Electronics Indonesia as exclusive partner of FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Our biggest gratitude to: HBTLaw, PT. Intiland, and PT. Permata Bank Tbk. who have consistently sponsored our program, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."
"SEHAT mailing list is supported by CBN Net for Internet Access &Website.

Kunjungi kami di (Visit us at):
Official Web : http://milissehat.web.id/
FB : http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milissehat/131922690207238
Twitter : @milissehat <http://twitter.com/milissehat/>
==================================================================
Donasi (donation):
Rekening Yayasan Orang Tua Peduli
Bank Mandiri
Cabang Kemang Raya Jakarta
Account Number: 126.000.4634514
==================================================================Yahoo! Groups Links



3b.

Re: [help] Minta Link bahaya waterbirth..

Posted by: "ChiciErnest" chici.ernest@gmail.com

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:20 am (PDT)



Mbak goofypinkku,

Mungkin maksud bunda, hypnobirthing tdk ada EBMnya (Evidence Based Medicine) jadi blm bs di buktikan secara ilmiah. kalau bukti hanya berbasis testimoni saja kan gak sah2 banget yaaa...
Kalau pengalaman saya, hypnobirthing gak ngaruh tuh. Tetep ajiiibbbb rasanya hehehe...

Regards,
@chiciernest

4.

Suspect nyeri di Lambung - Mungkinkah efek obat2an?

Posted by: "venyyosephine@gmail.com" venyyosephine@gmail.com

Wed Oct 19, 2011 4:19 am (PDT)



Dear all,

Mohon pencerahan ya. Ceritanya begini:
Saya operasi angkat tuba kiri tgl 4 oct (krn KET calon anak ke-2), keluar RS tgl 8 oct.

Tgl 15 kmrn mulai berasa sakit nyeri pada area perut kiri dan keseluruhan perut bawah jika ditekan2 pelan masih terasa sakit.
Yg paling masalah adalah nyeri pd sisi kiri.
Saya ke dokter umum, katanya nyeri di Lambung, dan diagnosa nya sembelit.
(Krn sy bilang susah BAB jg) dan si dokter suruh sy angkat kaki saat posisi rebahan, saat kaki kiri diangkat, nyeri memang makin terasa.

Sakit sekali saat mau BAB, persis rasa sakit waktu baru pagi hari saat sblm operasi KET.
Diresepkan : Ulsicral Sucralfate (untuk melindungi/melapisi lambung guna mencegah nyeri smakin parah), Solac Lactulose 3,335g (untuk 'membersihkan dan melunakkan proses pengeluaran', yg memang sy bilang ke dokter itu, perut terasa 'penuh'),Pariet 10mg sodium rabeprazole.

Kata dokter sesudah sy makan Solac (1x 1 hari, malam hari), paginya saya akan lebih lancar ke belakang.

Sudah 2 malam saya makan itu, tp smp sore ini belum ada efek jg, BAB bisa tp sedikit2 (suspect sy krn efek makan pepaya siy, bukan krn obat, krn sisa pepaya masih terlihat saat sy ke belakang *maaf*), perut msh tetap nyeri.

Sampe saat ini berdiri,duduk, smua posisi terasa nyeri, setiap saat berasa nyeri.
Tidur jg hanya mendingan saat miring ke kiri.

Apakah para dokter atau SPs disini ada saran, atau saya perlu konsultasi lagi dengan spesialis penyakit dalam?

Karena perasaan saya, ini tidak lg pengaruh operasi, that's why saya belum terpikir untuk balik ke dokter kandungan.

Mungkinkah sakit dilambung ini efek dari obat2an selama saya operasi + pemulihan operasi?
Krn saya memang maag, tp belakangan ini sy tidak pernah telat makan.
Bahkan cenderung sering ngemil jg. :(

Atau mungkin ini efek stres jg, anak ke-2 itu emang sudah kami tunggu2, jadi pusing jg saat tau tuba kiri harus diangkat :(.


Makasih banyak dan maaf jika terlalu panjang ya.

Best regards,

VenY
*rasanya besok mau nekat masuk kantor dulu deh, takutnya sakit tambahan ini krn stres di rmh mikirin sakit*

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5a.

Re: Mohon dibantu --> bingung soal batuk

Posted by: "Sisilia" sisil.mahadaya@gmail.com   caeciliapudjiastuti

Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:01 am (PDT)



Mbak Sundari sudah pernah baca soal batuk pilek di web sehat atau file dari moderator?

Banyak minum aja mbak, dan sambil observasi apakah alergi, bs debu, dingin atau makanan ttn. Kalau memang alergi tentu hrs dihindari pemicunya.

Maaf kalau kurang membantu.

Sisil
@sisilmahadaya

-----Original Message-----
From: feby eboy <fetriplef@gmail.com>
Sender: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 14:26:09
To: <sehat@yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sehat] Mohon dibantu --> bingung soal batuk

Alergi gak mbak.. Sol

Feby

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

6a.

MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "imel1405@gmail.com" imel1405@gmail.com   imel_1405

Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:19 am (PDT)



Dear SPs dan Doctors,

Sebelumnya maaf apabila sudah sering ditanyakan. Krn saya sedang tidak bisa browsing.

Anak saya 7th, blm imunisasi campak yang ke 2, MMR yg 1 dan 2, Hep A yg 1 dan 2. Apakah cukup MMR dan hep A? Apakah boleh digabung MMR dan hep A?

Anak saya 2.5th, belum imunisasi hep A yg ke 2, MMR yg 1 dan 2. Apakah boleh digabung MMR dan hep A?

Mohon bantuan untuk menjawab pertanyaan krn tadi ketika cek dokter agak ngotot untuk tidak memberikan MMR dan hep A secara bersamaan.

Terima kasih atas bantuannya.

BR,
Imel
Sent from my BlackBerry®
powered by Sinyal Kuat INDOSAT
6b.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "Sisilia" sisil.mahadaya@gmail.com   caeciliapudjiastuti

Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:22 am (PDT)



Mbak Imel,

Imunisasi aja simultan hep A dan MMR, boleh kok.

Sisil
@sisilmahadaya

6c.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "tristanathan.amadeo@gmail.com" tristanathan.amadeo@gmail.com   trinovi

Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:34 am (PDT)



Skip aja campaknya mbak, barengan aja kakak sama adik mmr + hep a skrg, mmr booster 3 bulan kemudian, atau 6 bln lg biar bs simultan lagi.

Thypoid n varicella udah kan?

-ria-

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6d.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id" purnamawati.spak@cbn.net.id

Wed Oct 19, 2011 5:50 am (PDT)



Nambahin sedikit
Si kakak DPT ke5 sudah?
Spy kata ria, cek tifus dan cacar airnya juga

Dan seperti kata sisil, kalau yg diatas semua sudah, simultan mmr dan hep Anya. Cari aja dokter anak lain or dokter umum or bidan yg mau nyuntik simultan

Wati
Patient Safety, first

6e.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "imel1405@gmail.com" imel1405@gmail.com   imel_1405

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:27 am (PDT)



Thank you, mbak Ria, mbak Sisil.

Anak saya yg besar belu imunisasi thypoid. Bgm sebaiknya?
Thx
Sent from my BlackBerry®
powered by Sinyal Kuat INDOSAT
6f.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "imel1405@gmail.com" imel1405@gmail.com   imel_1405

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:30 am (PDT)



Thanks, Bunda.
DPT 5 baru 3 bulan yll.
Varisela udah, thypoid belum.
Apakah boleh hepA, MMR dan thypoid sekalian?

Terima kasih atas perhatian n bantuannya.

BR,
Imel
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powered by Sinyal Kuat INDOSAT
6g.

Re: MMR dan Hep A

Posted by: "Sisilia" sisil.mahadaya@gmail.com   caeciliapudjiastuti

Wed Oct 19, 2011 7:00 am (PDT)



Mbak Imel,
Boleh simultan sekalian


Sisil
@sisilmahadaya

-----Original Message-----
From: imel1405@gmail.com
Sender: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wed, 19 Oct 2011 13:48:35
To: <sehat@yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To: sehat@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [sehat] MMR dan Hep A

Thank you, mbak Ria, mbak Sisil.

Anak saya yg besar belu imunisasi thypoid. Bgm sebaiknya?
Thx
Sent from my BlackBerry®
powered by Sinyal Kuat INDOSAT

------------------------------------

Milis SEHAT mengucapkan terimakasih kepada:
- Asuransi AIA atas partisipasinya sebagai sponsor PESAT Bali 2011
- PT LG Electronics Indonesia atas partisipasinya sebagai Sponsor Tunggal FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Terima kasih & penghargaan sedalam-dalamnya kepada : HBTLaw, PT.Intiland, dan PT. Permata Bank Tbk. yang telah dan konsisten mensponsori program kami, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."

"Milis SEHAT didukung oleh : CBN Net Internet Access &Website.
=================================================================
Milis Sehat thanks to:
- AIA Insurance as sponsor for PESAT Bali 2011
- PT LG Electronics Indonesia as exclusive partner of FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Our biggest gratitude to: HBTLaw, PT. Intiland, and PT. Permata Bank Tbk. who have consistently sponsored our program, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."
"SEHAT mailing list is supported by CBN Net for Internet Access &Website.

Kunjungi kami di (Visit us at):
Official Web : http://milissehat.web.id/
FB : http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milissehat/131922690207238
Twitter : @milissehat <http://twitter.com/milissehat/>
==================================================================
Donasi (donation):
Rekening Yayasan Orang Tua Peduli
Bank Mandiri
Cabang Kemang Raya Jakarta
Account Number: 126.000.4634514
==================================================================Yahoo! Groups Links

7.

(no subject)

Posted by: "anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com" anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com   anastasia.sabon

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:05 am (PDT)



Dear doc & sps,

Saya mau bertanya tt anak saya keanu.
Ketika lahir beratnya 3050 g.
Lahir pada tgl 25 agustus 2011.
Pada tgl 1 sept 2011 berat turun jadi 2865 g.
Pas 1 bulan berat badan jadi 3500g. Sekarang diusia hampir 2 bln berat badan 3850.
Apakah anak saya masih batas normal?
Bila saya baca tanda kecukupan asi berat badan dalam sebulan naik 500-1kg.
Keanu beratnya di bulan pertama hanya naik 450g. Apakah organ keanu akan tumbuh normal?
Saya sudah ke klinik laktasi. Sudah diberi vitamin untuk booster tapi kok produksi asi msh kurang. Saya musti ngapain?
Maaf ya kalo sudah pernah ada yang membahas.

Terima kasih,
Anas
MamanyaKeanu
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8a.

Re: re : FW: [Hukum-Online] Penyebab Harga Obat Mahal - Dokter Raup

Posted by: "drjohanwidj" drjohanwidj@yahoo.com   drjohanwidj

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:13 am (PDT)



Terima kasih atas peringatannya Bu.
Akan saya isi full form itu.

Johan

9a.

Mohon bantuan tt berat badan anak saya. Normalkah?

Posted by: "anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com" anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com   anastasia.sabon

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:17 am (PDT)



Dear doc & sps,

Saya mau bertanya tt anak saya keanu.
Ketika lahir beratnya 3050 g.
Lahir pada tgl 25 agustus 2011.
Pada tgl 1 sept 2011 berat turun jadi 2865 g.
Pas 1 bulan berat badan jadi 3500g. Sekarang diusia hampir 2 bln berat badan 3850.
Apakah anak saya masih batas normal?
Bila saya baca tanda kecukupan asi berat badan dalam sebulan naik 500-1kg.
Keanu beratnya di bulan pertama hanya naik 450g. Apakah organ keanu akan tumbuh normal?
Saya sudah ke klinik laktasi. Sudah diberi vitamin untuk booster tapi kok produksi asi msh kurang. Saya musti ngapain?
Maaf ya kalo sudah pernah ada yang membahas.

Terima kasih,
Anas
MamanyaKeanu
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9b.

Mohon bantuan tt berat badan anak saya. Normalkah?

Posted by: "anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com" anastasia.sabon@yahoo.com   anastasia.sabon

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:28 am (PDT)



Dear doc & sps,

Saya mau bertanya tt anak saya keanu.
Ketika lahir beratnya 3050 g.
Lahir pada tgl 25 agustus 2011.
Pada tgl 1 sept 2011 berat turun jadi 2865 g.
Pas 1 bulan berat badan jadi 3500g. Sekarang diusia hampir 2 bln berat badan 3850.
Apakah anak saya masih batas normal?
Bila saya baca tanda kecukupan asi berat badan dalam sebulan naik 500-1kg.
Keanu beratnya di bulan pertama hanya naik 450g. Apakah organ keanu akan tumbuh normal?
Saya sudah ke klinik laktasi. Sudah diberi vitamin untuk booster tapi kok produksi asi msh kurang. Saya musti ngapain?
Maaf ya kalo sudah pernah ada yang membahas.

Terima kasih,
Anas
MamanyaKeanu
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10.

imunisasi kurang

Posted by: "goofypinkku83@yahoo.com" goofypinkku83@yahoo.com   goofypinkku83

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:34 am (PDT)



Dear Sp and Bunda Wati,

Pas banget barusan ada yg nanya soal MMR dan Hep A saya jd ngecek data imunisasi anak saya. Dan ternyata tidak lengkap :'(

Anak saya umur 2 tahun 3 bulan, belum campak, belum tifoid, belum hep A, belum varisela dan belum Influenza. Apakah sudah telat dan tidak perlu lg diberikan untuk campaknya?
MMR baru sekali pd usia 14 bulan sewaktu tinggal di Inggris.
MenC sudah 3 kali juga ketika tinggal di Inggris. Sedangkan IPD (PVC), baru 3 kali, yang ke 2 dan ke 3 di Inggris juga.. Apakah butuh booster untuk MenC dan IPD?
Saya informasikan di Inggris karena katanya bisa2 beda spec imunisasinya. Betul begitu Bunda?

Terima kasih banyak.

Bunda Qinan.
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11.

Imunisasi yang kurang

Posted by: "goofypinkku83@yahoo.com" goofypinkku83@yahoo.com   goofypinkku83

Wed Oct 19, 2011 6:55 am (PDT)



Dear Sp and Bunda Wati,

Pas banget barusan ada yg nanya soal MMR dan Hep A saya jd ngecek data imunisasi anak saya. Dan ternyata tidak lengkap :'(

Anak saya umur 2 tahun 3 bulan, belum campak, belum tifoid, belum hep A, belum varisela dan belum Influenza. Apakah sudah telat dan tidak perlu lg diberikan untuk campaknya?
MMR baru sekali pd usia 14 bulan sewaktu tinggal di Inggris.
MenC sudah 3 kali juga ketika tinggal di Inggris. Sedangkan IPD (PVC), baru 3 kali, yang ke 2 dan ke 3 di Inggris juga.. Apakah butuh booster untuk MenC dan IPD?
Saya informasikan di Inggris karena katanya bisa2 beda spec imunisasinya. Betul begitu?

Terima kasih banyak.

Bunda Qinan.
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12.1.

Re: Need_Info: Tes Bakat Anak lewat Sidik Jari di Bekasi/Jakarta

Posted by: "aina" aina.anwar@yahoo.com   aina.anwar

Wed Oct 19, 2011 7:13 am (PDT)



Siapp mme marcella....


merci beaucoup
wassalamu'alaikum wr wb,


aina f.
13.

[SHARE] ini perjalanan RUMku, apa perjalanan RUMmu... (1)

Posted by: "Denella Hadibroto" denellahadibroto@yahoo.com   denellahadibroto

Wed Oct 19, 2011 7:20 am (PDT)



Dear SPs, Docs, dan Bunda Wati terkasih...

selama ini aku member pasif. boleh cerita ya... besok adalah awal dr tahun terakhir aku menikmati usia 20an. *ga penting* mungkin udah pada bosen baca tulisan: milis sehat udah ngebantu kenalan sama kesehatan yg rasional bla bla bla. tapi ya emang gitu. aku kok ngerasa ge-er kaya punya keluarga yg berdampingan di sini. kok ya kaya yg kalo bunda Wati nulis tuh kaya ngomong sama aku langsung sambil duduk bareng. *esape gw*
dulu... aku sering sakit. standar. Bat-pil. tiap kena tiap k dokter. bodo, orang diganti kantor Mama kok. pas kerja... krn kalo k dokter keluar uang lagi, padahal seingat aku resepnya kan ga jauh2 beda ya. jadi atas inisiatif sendiri, aku pun stock amox. tiap sakit minum dgn dosis kira2, sekitar 3x sehari tiap abis makan utk 3 hari berturut2. masih? tambah dong... v*cks f*rm*l* sampe satu waktu pas musim piala dunia, lagi nonton pemain bola yg ganteng2 itu kok jantung berdebar2. terus kalo berasa lagi radang tenggorokan, emut obat apa yg enak itu rocher ya? sama konsumsi rutin c*r. pinter ya akuh..! :p
pas aku hamil, tahun 2008. tes torch, cmv tinggi banget tapi yg bukan penyakit, yg tanda pernah infeksi di masa lampau apa tuh igg apa ya? sama dsog diresepkan isoprinosine. than i lost my baby in 12w pregnancy. katanya sih udah tdk berkembang 2minggu. tanpa 2nd opinion, aku minum citotek (nulisnya gimana sih). dan isoprinosine terus. ceritanya, diagnosanya antibodi antisperma aku ketinggian. syukur sperma suami bisa membuahi. tapi ternyata janin dianggap benda asing, sehingga si antibodi ini bereaksi. dan aku treatment lah lagi. alhamdulillah mid 2009 aku hamil lagi. dikasih susu yg amit2 mihil & ga enak. isoprinosine masih terus. aku pun berniat waterbirth.
※※※ bersambung ※※※

Ella bundanya Talita

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Milis SEHAT mengucapkan terimakasih kepada:
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- PT LG Electronics Indonesia atas partisipasinya sebagai Sponsor Tunggal FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Terima kasih & penghargaan sedalam-dalamnya kepada : HBTLaw, PT.Intiland, dan PT. Permata Bank Tbk. yang telah dan konsisten mensponsori program kami, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."

"Milis SEHAT didukung oleh : CBN Net Internet Access &Website.
=================================================================
Milis Sehat thanks to:
- AIA Insurance as sponsor for PESAT Bali 2011
- PT LG Electronics Indonesia as exclusive partner of FAMILY FUN DAY MILIS SEHAT 2011.

Our biggest gratitude to: HBTLaw, PT. Intiland, and PT. Permata Bank Tbk. who have consistently sponsored our program, PESAT (Program Edukasi Kesehatan Anak Untuk Orang Tua)."
"SEHAT mailing list is supported by CBN Net for Internet Access &Website.

Kunjungi kami di (Visit us at):
Official Web : http://milissehat.web.id/
FB           : http://www.facebook.com/pages/Milissehat/131922690207238
Twitter      : @milissehat <http://twitter.com/milissehat/>
==================================================================
Donasi (donation):
Rekening Yayasan Orang Tua Peduli
Bank Mandiri
Cabang Kemang Raya Jakarta
Account Number: 126.000.4634514
==================================================================
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